Rebuild of J176350 |
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otto
Member Joined: 26 Feb. 2012 Location: Orygun Status: Offline Points: 2240 |
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The "jeep wave" is just when jeep drivers would pass one another and would simply wave (using all fingers) to the other driver much like motorcyclists do. Maybe this doesn't happen as much now with all the many Jeep vehicles on the road. |
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47 CJ2A w/fuel injected boat engine
48 CJ2A 64 Ford Econoline Travelwagon If you can't get there in a Jeep, get a motorcycle! |
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athawk11
Member Joined: 18 Jan. 2012 Location: Arvada,Colorado Status: Offline Points: 4145 |
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One more "glass half full" moment. The missing radiator fluid happens because the engine block is filling up with water. I have had to add radiator fluid after 'first time engine runs' on both of my minor rebuilds.
Tim |
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1- 1946 CJ2A
2- 1949 CJ3A |
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Bruce W
Member Joined: 29 July 2005 Location: Northeast Colorado Status: Offline Points: 9611 |
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When draining the oil in a case like this (always, actually) I unscrew the last thread of the drain plug slowly, and ease the plug away from the hole by about a 1/16" to see if any water comes out before the oil. Water and oil will not stay mixed, and water will go to the bottom. Check the oil you drained out and see if there's water in the bottom of the drain pan.
Before you get too wild with taking things apart, pressure test the cooling system, and if it goes down, then look for where it's going. Then you can pull the side cover or the pan for a better look. Also pull the spark plugs and check for water in the combustion chambers / cylinders. Don't pull the head until you're sure you know where the water is going, and you're done testing. BW |
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It is NOT a Jeep Willys! It is a Willys jeep.
Happy Trails! Good-bye, Good Luck, and May the Good Lord Take a Likin' to You! We Have Miles to Jeep, Before We Sleep. |
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mike in oregon
Member Sponsor Member Joined: 17 Jan. 2008 Location: Fall Creek Or Status: Offline Points: 1988 |
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Rob my heart it is sinking reading this. The engine I am running in my jeep now was cracked when I had it rebuilt and I had it pined to repair the crack around the dist. area. Then I found it was cracked inside the dist. hole also which I repaired with the pipe trick and epoxy down the hole which is working great. My be there was some sealer some ware that was dissolved when it was hot tanked? I think I would pull the pan as that is pretty easy and you should be able to see were the water is coming from. Edited by mike in oregon - 06 May 2017 at 1:37am |
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MIKE IN OREGON
President of Oregon Flat Fender Club. http://www.facebook.com/pages/Oregon-Flat-Fender-Club/222864787838570 46 CJ2A 38007 46 CJ2A 79863 BANTAM T3-C 25314 |
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Ol' Unreliable
Member Joined: 25 Sep. 2016 Location: CO Springs CO Status: Offline Points: 4226 |
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I still get return waves from some Jeeps, even JKs. Too many don't know the "Jeep Wave", though. |
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There's a reason it's called Ol' Unreliable
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otto
Member Joined: 26 Feb. 2012 Location: Orygun Status: Offline Points: 2240 |
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Sage advice Bruce. I did try to just crack the drain plug and see if any water would come out, but made a giant mess and drained out everything. I think pressure testing the cooling system is a great idea and something I want to try, but all the radiator cap type testers that I can find fit the smaller, more modern sized radiators. Maybe removing the heater valve in the head and fitting something there might work. The spark plugs looked good except for cylinder #4 which was wet. Inside the spark plug hole I could see some rust forming around what looked like a valve seat. There was a crack repair done between cylinders 3 and 4 in the block deck.
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47 CJ2A w/fuel injected boat engine
48 CJ2A 64 Ford Econoline Travelwagon If you can't get there in a Jeep, get a motorcycle! |
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otto
Member Joined: 26 Feb. 2012 Location: Orygun Status: Offline Points: 2240 |
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47 CJ2A w/fuel injected boat engine
48 CJ2A 64 Ford Econoline Travelwagon If you can't get there in a Jeep, get a motorcycle! |
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otto
Member Joined: 26 Feb. 2012 Location: Orygun Status: Offline Points: 2240 |
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I remember this from when I was in high school in the early 80s. My first real car was a Jeep J-3000 PU and from time to time other drivers would wave, primarily driving other jeeps. I also remember fixing a flat tire on the truck on the shoulder of the road once, and a CJ driver stopped to see if I needed any help. It didn't seem to bother him that he had traffic backed up behind him as we were talking!
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47 CJ2A w/fuel injected boat engine
48 CJ2A 64 Ford Econoline Travelwagon If you can't get there in a Jeep, get a motorcycle! |
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mike in oregon
Member Sponsor Member Joined: 17 Jan. 2008 Location: Fall Creek Or Status: Offline Points: 1988 |
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Rob even if you don't get a jeep running you are still welcome to come down and join along as I am sure we will have plenty of seats to go around. Not as much fun I know but better then nothing.
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MIKE IN OREGON
President of Oregon Flat Fender Club. http://www.facebook.com/pages/Oregon-Flat-Fender-Club/222864787838570 46 CJ2A 38007 46 CJ2A 79863 BANTAM T3-C 25314 |
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otto
Member Joined: 26 Feb. 2012 Location: Orygun Status: Offline Points: 2240 |
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I tried a few experiments this weekend to locate where the water was coming from inside the engine. I placed a "T" in the heater hose with a bicycle pump attached to pressurize the cooling system. That didn't work so well as it just made bubbles in the radiator- the cap doesn't really seal so it couldn't build pressure anyway. I also poured a fresh gallon of oil in the engine and ran it for about ten minutes to flush out the water/oil mixture that was left in the engine. When this oil was drained, it seemed like a lot of water droplets were exiting the oil pan after the bulk of oil was drained. I removed the left fender and the side cover to the engine (as the shop wanted me to) and found no evidence of water in there. Removed the oil pan and found water droplets running down cylinder #4 between the cylinder water and the piston. The cylinder head was removed next- evidence of water was obvious in #4, but I can't find any clear failure of the head gasket. I'm leaning towards this crack repair as being the culprit as the source of water. I have a good photo of the crack repair between #3 and 4, but can't figure out how to post it here from my I phone.
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47 CJ2A w/fuel injected boat engine
48 CJ2A 64 Ford Econoline Travelwagon If you can't get there in a Jeep, get a motorcycle! |
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otto
Member Joined: 26 Feb. 2012 Location: Orygun Status: Offline Points: 2240 |
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In the short term, I'm going to try using a copper head gasket with a generous application of the copper spray. Long term- start shopping for a different block. I did a search for the term "copper head gasket" here in the forum, but really didn't find a definitive source for this gasket. I did see a copper gasket at Walck's but it appeared to be a copper sandwich type gasket. I'm thinking a solid copper gasket might work. Does such a thing exist? I have two flat machined surfaces on the head and block so if there is a solid copper gasket hopefully it might possibly seal. This is kind of a "hail Mary" effort.
The shop gave me a bottle of block seal to try, but I really don't want this stuff in the radiator.
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47 CJ2A w/fuel injected boat engine
48 CJ2A 64 Ford Econoline Travelwagon If you can't get there in a Jeep, get a motorcycle! |
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JeepSaffer
Member Joined: 26 Sep. 2014 Location: South Africa Status: Offline Points: 1181 |
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Solid copper head gaskets certainly do exist... I just bought and used one. But i'm in South Africa and you are in the USA . I don't know where it was made originally or where it came from. There were no identification marks on it.
I'm going to investigate getting some made, because the one I bought was %!&$ expensive. Still doesn't help you, sorry, except to say they do exist. |
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1948 CJ2A #204853 in South Africa
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otto
Member Joined: 26 Feb. 2012 Location: Orygun Status: Offline Points: 2240 |
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I'm going to start looking for another engine block, are there any visual clues that would distinguish a gear-drive block from a chain driven one? I certainly don't want to buy something I can't use. Are the numbers on the block my best indicator?
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47 CJ2A w/fuel injected boat engine
48 CJ2A 64 Ford Econoline Travelwagon If you can't get there in a Jeep, get a motorcycle! |
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JeepSaffer
Member Joined: 26 Sep. 2014 Location: South Africa Status: Offline Points: 1181 |
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Otto, this is very interesting as I am looking at a valve job right now and still need to order parts. Finding parts locally is very advantageous for obvious reasons. Did the valve set have part numbers on them that I could call Federal Mogul up and say "I need four of XXX and four of YYY"? What was contained in the kit? Valves, guides, springs? I would be pleased as punch if I could find these items locally... Please let me know... Mike
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1948 CJ2A #204853 in South Africa
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otto
Member Joined: 26 Feb. 2012 Location: Orygun Status: Offline Points: 2240 |
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Mike,
Luckily, I had a photo of the parts where the number was visible (because I threw away the boxes) and could see it. The Sealed Power part # for I believe the intakes was V-341, and from memory the exhaust valves # was V-340. I bought these through Rock Auto so their invoice may carry their own numbering system. There was no kit, just valves in a box. Wouldn't it be great if you only had to walk down the street and get them? Rob
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47 CJ2A w/fuel injected boat engine
48 CJ2A 64 Ford Econoline Travelwagon If you can't get there in a Jeep, get a motorcycle! |
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SE Kansas 46 CJ-2A
Member Sponsor Member x 3 Joined: 22 Jan. 2016 Location: S.E. Kansas Status: Offline Points: 3183 |
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Mike: Otto is correct. V-340 is the exhaust valve and V-341 is the intake. These are Sealed Power numbers and I have a set of each ready to go into a new block and they were made in South Africa. Federal-Mogul uses the same parts numbers as Sealed Power.
Hope this helps... |
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46 CJ-2A #64462 "Ol' Red" (bought April 1969)(second owner)(12 V, 11" brakes, M-38 frame, MD Juan tub)
U.S. Coast Guard Chief Petty Officer(ret.) U.S. Army Vietnam veteran and damned proud of it. |
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JeepSaffer
Member Joined: 26 Sep. 2014 Location: South Africa Status: Offline Points: 1181 |
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Thanks guys, this is useful information. I have made contact with Federal Mogul and they are about 50km from my house! I did speak to someone there, but the news is not good:
Federal Mogul is an international manufacturing company that makes all sorts of things. One of their product lines is valve train components, and they market these under the brand name of Sealed Power. They do make V-340 and V-341 here in South Africa and were able to look up on the computer and confirmed they were for the L134. However (and this is the bad news), because the market here in South Africa is so small (there must be less than two hundred L134 engines on the roads), all the valves they make are for the export market. They said they would look if there was a production run planned to fulfill an order and make some extra for me, but there are no outstanding orders to be fulfilled. And they are certainly not going to do a production run of 4 valves for me on the intake and 4 valves on the exhaust. So although the valves are made 50km from my house, I am going to have to order some that have been shipped to the USA, and then ship them back over here, with shipping costs both ways and everyone's markup thrown in along the way. How is that for crazy? |
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1948 CJ2A #204853 in South Africa
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JeepSaffer
Member Joined: 26 Sep. 2014 Location: South Africa Status: Offline Points: 1181 |
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Well, sometimes you just hit it lucky... and when you do you shouldn't complain.
My contact at Federal Mogul in South Africa called back to say that he has searched their warehouse and he found they have some un-allocated stock on the shelves. Further, they are prepared to sell to me, although they are primarily a manufacturer and do not normally retail. Maybe I should go and buy a lottery ticket this evening? |
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1948 CJ2A #204853 in South Africa
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